I'm starting to worry about Dragmeister, he was going riding this last weekend, hope he's OK. Anyone heard from him?

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Yes...but your CBR LOOKS the shit!

I don't think anyone really posts over in "ride reports" any more.

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 11/27/2012 @ 8:59 AM *

I had read this before prior to buying the BMW but it's even more of an interesting read after our real world comparison last Sunday. Some things contradict what both Kruz and I observed, such as ergo's and electronics favoring the S1000RR, (Kruz finding the BMW's trac control to be more intrusive, while I didn't notice much difference). I found the ZX-10R more comfortable and bigger feeling. They like the BMW. Either way, more testimony to the excellence of both bikes. The Kawi won the the Jap comparison, (usual suspects) and then went onto to compete with the Euro comparison winner, BMW S1000, that competed with Aprilia RSV4 Factory, Duc 1199 Pani, and MV F4R.

From August 2012 Motorcyclist
"Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery"

When Kawasaki’s ZX-10R bested the rest of the Japanese superbikes in Part I of our “Class of 2012” comparison (MC, July), we said that victory only guaranteed its position in the ring with the winner of Part II, our European shootout. But rather than facing off against a certain ultra-expensive and sophisticated V-twin as many expected, the Ninja went up against its closest European counterpart, the four-cylinder BMW S1000RR.

Totally redesigned from the contact patches up in 2011, the Kawasaki debuted as the first Japanese superbike to feature traction control. Nothing changed for 2012, but sharp styling and outstanding performance have kept the Ninja fresh. It beat the competition with the same set of assets the S1000RR employed: accommodating ergos and street manners, superior horsepower, stable handling and stupendous brakes. At the track the ZX-10R took a lot of set-up time, however, as it suffered from a slammed rear end that made it slow to turn. We also wished it had an electronic quick-shifter, as transmission action wasn’t the smoothest.

The BMW is European by birth, but its DNA was harvested in the Land of the Rising Sun. While the Euro-bikes’ engine and chassis designs are all over the board, the S1000RR architecture is completely in line with the ZX-10R, as well as every other Japanese sportbike’s. Of the two, the BMW boasts greater power and a superior traction-control system. While both bikes are limited to just four TC settings, the Beemer’s are more refined, offering less intrusive wheelie control and more consistent and transparent slide management.

On the other hand, at just 442 lbs. wet, the ZX-10R is 17 lbs. lighter than the S1000RR, and combined with better mass centralization it feels lighter still. It also has better brakes, offering the same stopping power but with better feel and feedback.

On top of that, the Kawasaki is $3000 less expensive (adding the optional ABS reduces that to $2000) than the BMW, and it was the unrivalled winner at the racetrack. Shod with the same Pirelli tires as the Euro-bikes, it turned a best lap of 1:53-flat, making it the quickest of all. But lap times aren’t everything, and while the Kawasaki is impressive, the BMW is even more so. It cranks out over 10 more horsepower with more linear delivery; comes stock with a quick-shifter, better TC and ABS; and worked remarkably well at the racetrack right out of the box. It’s also more comfortable, with a softer seat and more spacious cockpit. And did we mention it’s available with heated handgrips?

The BMW is a hybrid—a German interpretation of a Japanese literbike, executed with inexpugnable European flair. It offers the cachet of its Continental peers without compromising comfort or accessibility. They say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, but what happens when the imitator outdoes the original? It becomes the new standard—and that's what the S1000RR is.?MC

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Excellent reviews guys! I actually test rode both and agreed with the general opinion. I felt a lack of mid range with the ZX-10, I felt the same with the S'thou but it was pronounced on the ZX-10 what didn't help is that I had just gotten off my ZX-14. It' all relative because that same day I wasn't impress with the 14R mid range as well. Also I felt more comfy on the Beemer, on the ZX-10 I had to work hard to keep weight off my wrists and didn't enjoy the lower seating position. By the way the S'thou is notorious for throwing stones. I got a hole in my radiator when I was following one this fall and the following week, the victim was Ducati 1098. It can't be a coincidence.

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The ZX10R turned a 1:53, I'm curious as to the S1000RR lap time, is there a link to that article, I'd like to read it?

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http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/features/122_1208_bmw_s1000rr_and_kawasaki_zx_10r/

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Kruz-
The Euro's:

BMW S1000RR

Best Lap: 1:53.8

Aprilia RSV4 Factory APRC

Best Lap: 1:53.4

Ducati 1199 Panigale S

Best Lap: 1:53.9

MV Agusta F4R

Best Lap: 1:55.3

The Japanese: (For some reason they list the lap time first and the bike second for the Jap liters)

Best Lap: 1:54.13

Honda CBR1000RR

Best Lap: 1:53.13

Kawasaki ZX-10R

Best Lap: 1:54.33

Suzuki GSX-R1000

Best Lap: 1:54.84

Yamaha YZF-R1

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Excellent reviews guys! I actually test rode both and agreed with the general opinion. I felt a lack of mid range with the ZX-10, I felt the same with the S'thou but it was pronounced on the ZX-10 what didn't help is that I had just gotten off my ZX-14. It' all relative because that same day I wasn't impress with the 14R mid range as well. Also I felt more comfy on the Beemer, on the ZX-10 I had to work hard to keep weight off my wrists and didn't enjoy the lower seating position. By the way the S'thou is notorious for throwing stones. I got a hole in my radiator when I was following one this fall and the following week, the victim was Ducati 1098. It can't be a coincidence.

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DK-
It's extremely interesting to get so many first hand opinions. When you're out on the road as Kruz and I were, had already ridden over 125 miles, full throttle and everything in between, stop in the middle of a deserted road, swap bike and get back on the throttle of a new liter bike beneath you, pull off in a rush while not being particularly conservative on the throttle or rpm's, I think it feels different. A fair amount of adrenalin running through the system probably also skews the experience from pulling up to a dealer and hopping on a demo bike. I seem to remember thinking the S'Thou was more down on midrange, (even after punching the fueling up and adding a tooth in the sprocket for 2012) than the ZX10 I used to demo from the dealer, but neither one really disappointed or surprised me because I knew the fun was to be had else where in the rev band and frankly already owning two VERY torquey bikes that don't require full use of the rev band to rocket, I kind of enjoyed needing to wind them up in order for the heavens to open up and see the face of God. That they both do. Also, now I'm thinking I found the ZX10-R more roomy and comfortable because it was bit lower to the ground and not as tippy. I don't know but most seem to agree with you that the BMW is the more comfy of the two. Either way, guess where I went today over lunch? Man this is getting really sick but that new Black and white ZX10R is pretty bad ass looking AND the red and black 2012 sitting there is gorgeous and can be had for the right price at this point in the year. My wife is seriously going to suggest therapy. Sad part is, she's probably right:)

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ydgI42nSAQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player

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Here is my favortie quote on the ZX-10R from the Motorcylist issue comparing the four Jap bikes:

"The ZX-10R feels like a baby ZX-14R on the freeway: big, stable, smooth and stinking-fast when you got up in the revs. Opening this one up really feels like you’re pulling the trigger on something powerful, which wasn’t an impression the other bikes conveyed. It’s got a muted-but-appealing exhaust note and the kind of midrange power and subdued engine vibration that make you forget which gear you’re in. Push the tachometer past 9000 rpm, however, and the ZX-10R tries to rip your arms off! The Kawasaki was noticeably faster on Chuckwalla’s short straights, and it has mega-brakes that are a step above the rest in terms of feel and power."

And a couple of favorites on the S1000, (except for the transmission comments which I do not agree with) from the same magaines comparo of the European bikes:

"Like many motorcycles we’ve tested this year, the new S1000RR makes less power than before, dropping 5 bhp to 169 at the rear wheel. Still, acceleration contests were no contest: The BMW was the only bike to dip into the 9s, scorching the quarter-mile in 9.95 seconds at 148.32 mph. The 999cc four makes huge power everywhere, then finishes with an eye-watering top-end rush. The transmission is the only powertrain complaint, a long throw between gears leading to clunky action and an occasional missed shift, despite the electronic shift-assist.

Not only is the S1000RR the only bike here that you’d want to ride for more than one tank of gas, it’s likely the most comfortable sportbike made today. The cockpit is roomy, with a supportive and unexpectedly soft saddle. The high, flat bars orient your wrists at a natural angle, the upper fairing creates a bubble of still air and the mirrors actually provide a rear view. The real prize, however, is heated handgrips! Laugh all you want, but these proved indispensible on the street. Excepting a high-frequency vibration through the handlebars at sustained high rpm, the S-dog’s street manners were beyond criticism."

* Last updated by: Jagman on 11/27/2012 @ 4:00 PM *

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Either way, guess where I went today over lunch? Man this is getting really sick but that new Black and white ZX10R is pretty bad ass looking AND the red and black 2012 sitting there is gorgeous and can be had for the right price at this point in the year. My wife is seriously going to suggest therapy. Sad part is, she's probably right:)

Your freakin nuts...lol...mommas gonna send you packin if you bring home that 2012! BTW, that is the one I wanted, that red/black is wicked lookin, makes the all black look plain jane IMHO.

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Your freakin nuts...lol...mommas gonna send you packin if you bring home that 2012! BTW, that is the one I wanted, that red/black is wicked lookin, makes the all black look plain jane IMHO.

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She'll just give me one of those "are you losing your mind looks":) I'll have to of course ask her the proverbial cliche question of whether she would prefer I be dropping $20 bills in G strings and hanging out at bars all night:)
But Kruz...I gotta tell you that Red and black 10 is one very sick looking bike! Seriously nice looking!

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Get it, like you said at lunch on Sunday you've done the time, put in the long hours and you can't take it with you! BTW, see if you can pick up a ZX-6R as part of a package deal and to complete the set. I may take my 6R this weekend if we go again.

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The red/black is sick, I may have to order a new set of fairings!

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The Japanese: (For some reason they list the lap time first and the bike second for the Jap liters)
Best Lap: 1:54.13

Honda CBR1000RR
Best Lap: 1:53.13

Kawasaki ZX-10R

Oh so the 10R turned the 1:53:13, not the Honda, you had me confused there with that chart.

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Love the white and black!

I hear you... a demo ride is not enough to make a decision between two bikes that are that close. My lack of midrange syndrome mostly comes from the fact that the 14 is my first and only bike.

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One thing I'm noticing, lap time standings seem to vary according to track and who's doing the riding. This shows no one bike is dominant on all tracks under all test riders. In one sportbike shootout a few years back, they tested supersports and liters against each other amd a Triumph 675 almost set the lap record. Pronably a very tight track.

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The white/black is sharp, I'd love to put red/blue light bars and a "To Serve and Protect" and Texas Highway Patrol decal on that thing, prolly get arrested for that though.

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yeah that's why I don't pay too much attention to those, unless there is a huge difference. There are too many variables.

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Seriously guys, all of these bikes are so stinking fast it doesn't make ANY difference unless you are making a living racing them. It's just a measuring stick. All that really matters, (particularly these days) is:

-Do you want/need electronics on your chosen liter bike?

-Which one do you feel the most comfortable AND confident on?

-What kind of suspension do you prefer? Even with adjustments, they will all have a certain feel.

-Do you prefer more mid range torque and less top end, somewhere in the middle or lower mid and explosive top end? Most bikes these days I would consider are right in the middle, but essentially what is the street rideability of the bike?

-Which one offers the highest level of pride of ownership?

BUT mostly---

-Which one is the most fun to ride?!

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The red/black is sick, I may have to order a new set of fairings!

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That is actually a cool option!

BTW, speaking of Cop bikes, I swear that when I ride this bike, I literally have cars slow to a crawl in front of me!:)

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Yep, that would make me nervous if I saw it coming up behind me.

All good points there Jag, most guys I've seen with MV and Ducati buy strictly for curb appeal, you could park an eighteen wheeler on the chicken stripes! But what the heck, too each his own and I'm sure there's a few that can wring the bikes neck.

What surprised me was the 2012 liter shootout with no less than Erik Bostrom twisting the throttles. He said the strongest feeling bike was the Gixxer Thou....go figure?

Buy what turns you on and set it up for your weight and riding style.

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The Gixxer 1000 has a phenomenal mid range I hear. The perfect bike for hooligans. So I'm not surprised he said that. I know how Kawasaki is going to battle the S'Thou: electronics, weight and competitive power but I have no idea about Honda's answer. Unfortunately, if don't jump into the hp/electronics war pretty soon, they will be left behind. I really like the ZX-10 but ergo wise the S'Thou' fits me better. What modes did you guys ride in? Was the Beemer more prone to wheelie?

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I stay always in F1, only time I tried F2 I didn't care for it. I'm really surprised to hear you prefer the CBR ergos to the 10. Exact opposite for me, CBR cockpit feels cramped, feet too high, 10 feels roomy with pegs dropped to lower position.

Dyno reports can be misleading, a bike can have big midrange numbers but slow throttle response and not feel as quick as a bike with weaker numbers but revs out quickly. I think Jag and I noticed the same thing, the 10 feels lively, punchy in the midrange despite what the dyno says. Same thing on the BMW.

I also notice this when the CBR wad tested against the Ducati 1198. The Duc has a huge paper advantage with a torque curve that literally towers over the Honda's but the Honda is just as punchy after you factor in gearing.

Ever seen a rear wheel thrust chart for the BMW, each gear curve intersects the next almost perfectly, this explains the fast quarter mile times. Ducatis have notoriously bad gearing ratios but on the track, they seem to work, quarter times not so good.

* Last updated by: Kruz on 11/27/2012 @ 10:20 PM *

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Awfully quite out there, too quiet, I wonder if Jagmeister is down at the Kawsaki dealer making a bid on that 2012 ZX-10?

If you get it Jag, go with the Austin Racing GP3 Slipon, about $1200. Keep the stock titanium headers, they are very good, nothing to gain by going aftermarket. Have ECU Unleashed or Guhl do your ECU reflash to Euro specs and specific to the GP3 pipe. You will have an absolute missile on your hands, get ready! As for me, I'm staying stock, I like the fact I can push that bike hard and it never feels like it's going to get away from me on those back roads....confidence baby!

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