Lack of critical thought.

You forgot to read the final part of the paragraph, and so failed to make a point.

This changes the meaning of the first part of the paragraph:

Well, maybe not, we have to wait for the 2012 ZX14R to see if that is possible

The point is... right now....Hub makes a hell of a lot of sense!

* Last updated by: blue07 on 9/26/2011 @ 1:45 PM *

Lack of critical thought.

You forgot to read the final part of the paragraph, and so failed to make a point.

This changes the meaning of the first part of the paragraph:

i can take a 06 zx14and $5,000.00 and make it alot faster than any $15,000.00 2012 zx14.. just send your $50.00 and i'll tell you how..

Yea but can he call you? That's the Jeffco difference....unlimited calls for fifty bucks with free anytime minutes on nights and weekends!

* Last updated by: Kruz on 9/26/2011 @ 8:25 PM *

As far as service, Jeffo responds fast. I am having some dragon fire out the mufflers in certain situations. It is clearly a rich condition resulting from rolling off the throttle while the pump is active.

We talked about the rpm range, the direction the throttle is going, where it is starting from, and so forth. I've got guys in my mc who ask to follow me in group because they get a kick out of it when it does that. I've had race cars that did a lot worse, and were tuned perfectly.

But, the result is, Jeffo told me to knock 2% off the pump settings for revolutions and %fuel, and leave sensitivity alone.

This is how I have tuned race engines all my life. Run it a while. Talk about it. Incrementally change it, just one thing please. Try it again. These days, folks can hook dataloggers up and really see what needs to change. But over the phone, Jeffo is helping me do the best form of tuning we can do without meeting at a dyno shop.

And I agree with him, I think the excess fuel is resulting from the pump being too rich, and slightly scaling back the settings which control that is the way to test the theory, without risking a problem. 2% won't lean it out, it might not even be enough to stop the dragon fire.

KHI delivers the ZX14 with an ECU set up to run the engine rich, to protect it when people hot rod it, and when they put more open exhausts (or knock the cats out of stock exhausts) without putting a piggy on with a map tuned to the new conditions.

So I paid $50 for that map, I like the map, and I think I can squeeze better mpg out of it if I knock the dragon fire down a little. I mean, the tranlucent decals on the windshield say, in Kanji, Black Dragon, but enough is enough. Heh.

And when I emailed Jeffo, he called me, had a record of what map he sent me, and the pump settings, and when he couldn't convince me to pull the secondaries, he agreed we should tone down the pump settings slightly and try it.

Brock Davidson, when I called him about his map back-firing, basically told me tough. I like Brock, he's been really helpful, and gone out of his way to cut me deals, and give me information about things like center stand stops, etc. But when it comes to map support, Jeffo has it all over anyone I know of who sells maps.

haha can't believe this debate is still on going

Got me a Brocks now, no more map troubles.

* Last updated by: Monster14 on 9/28/2011 @ 5:56 PM *

haha can't believe this debate is still on going

Will never end... soon people will be sending Jeffo $50 to "tune" their 2012's.

Hey Monster, good to see you back on here, was wondering what happened to you. Yea, two years on this thread and still running, gotta be some kind of record!

Hey whats up Kruz. I check in once in a while but have not posted for some time, looks like somethings never change.
I'm sure by now Jeffo put together a map that will keep your plugs alive, but all you happy campers be glad you were not his first guinea pig like I was. Just know if anything gets screwed up on your bike because of his map, he will not pay to fix it nor will he give you a refund. I don't do business with that kind of person.

Yep Hub, that thought crossed my mind a few times, Jeffo has banked off of this site, probably paid for his new iphone and Monsteer gets stuck with a bill and I lose my $50. Jeffo gives a disclaimer now on his website, no refund unless you call him and give him a chance to resole the problem.

With most businesses offering a product or service that's OK. What I can't buy is the methodology here, vis-a- vis....oh I sent you a map that doesn't work, so you (not an expert or you'd be making your own maps) tell me what you think is wrong and I'll keep guessing at the numbers until you are satisfied or your plugs foul out or you blow your motor. All of this over the phone with no verification on a dyno or gas analyzer. Jeffo's going to melt down someones motor, it's just a matter of time. Monsteer got off lucky IMHO with only a $300 repair bill.

Jeffo's going to melt down someones motor,

no he's not ..what gonna happen is the top of the pistons will carbon up and bang into the valves or head and bust a rod.. or the extra unburnt fuel will fluid lock the cylinder and lift the head busting a head gasket..theres a reason to the plug change he recommends ..

* Last updated by: Badzx14r on 9/30/2011 @ 3:46 PM *

soon people will be sending Jeffo $50 to "tune" their 2012's.

I keep reading this thread going on and on and on and on..................

After reading Kruz's post I decided I was going to give my input

With most businesses offering a product or service that's OK. What I can't buy is the methodology here, vis-a- vis....oh I sent you a map that doesn't work, so you (not an expert or you'd be making your own maps) tell me what you think is wrong and I'll keep guessing at the numbers until you are satisfied or your plugs foul out or you blow your motor. All of this over the phone with no verification on a dyno or gas analyzer. Jeffo's going to melt down someones motor, it's just a matter of time. Monsteer got off lucky IMHO with only a $300 repair bill.

I Hauled my 06 4 hours to a well known tuner in the Detroit area. I had a custom set of pipes and didn't want to burn things up. I really didn't care what the dyno #'s were as long as it was tuned right. I rode the bike in the parking lot and at home before I took it. It ran, but not like it should. It had a bad spot where it fell on it's face. When this guy was done it didn't run at all and he said my PC3 was bad and if I got another one on a holiday weekend he would redo it for free. I hauled it back an hour to where I was staying, got out my stuff, and put my generic DJ map back in. Surprise! It runs again, just like before he touched it. Put the stock pipes and 0 map in and WA LA it runs like it should.

This trip cost me about $600 and I almost had junk. Luckily I have you guys on here and enough ability to use my knowledge to fix it. Some people would have been SOL. The moral of my story is a dyno can suck just as much as Monster's experience with Jeffo. I ride with Scottjkl and his bike has run awesome for 2 seasons with a Jeffo map and mine runs great with what I have. I would rather run a little fat with a fat manufacturer map then deal with that again.

I would rather run a little fat with a fat manufacturer map then deal with that again.

My point EXACTLY.

It had a bad spot where it fell on it's face.

post a pic. Tell you exactly where it was with out you saying. If spark came back with smoke your rich, back with flame your lean. Keep doing it you will pay.

Some people would have been SOL.

Not if you post here, if you way off the Norm guys will fix you up. They will Warn you anyway. Some people Can't be told. In life you have to make your own mistakes.

Once again, if you don't know what your AFR#'s are your running blind and Trust from others must be earned. Can't be given over the phone.

Jeffs #'s are a mirror image of others in the Top End, MIDDLE is his own. Those of you here who study 14 maps know what I talking about. Just because your running does not mean your running safe. The only trust we have here is,,,,,, we know where Monster burnt up. Move up 2% Game back on.

Keep a open mind ? If your running with the flies out in the area in the map where all others have posted it to be lean and you are taking fuel away, below the Stock ECU setting, alarm bells should be going off.

How can some one take that exact area and minus a shit load of fuel and not get your attention ? If you look what others have added to be safe and look at his minus, the two #'s combined = Scary. If some one has the Brock Dyno pic please post it, it help show you where to look. Shows lean from factory with flies out.

Please don't take my word for it. Just take a look at your map up the middle and do your own map compares.

What if Jeffs was made on a Dyno with Real AFR#'s ? This thread will live until some one shuts the door.

I wish jeff would post.

* Last updated by: Romans on 9/30/2011 @ 10:17 PM *

I wish jeff would post.

Romans....I think we done pissed Jeffo off..

Romans....I think we done pissed Jeffo off..

That was done long ago so don't worry about him coming back even if his maps are working.

Remember that there are people who will also tell you that every tuner in the nation is stupid but theirs and anything one does that is not what they agree with are stupid also. It is the internet so if one person has a problem it will become an epidemic and spread like cheap hot wing sauce. Not everybody that has a 14 is WOT constantly and many just hot dog so to some not every ride is procircut and you don't have to be a little rich every other 100 rpm.

Yes I also believe that a real dyno tune is the way to go but Jeffo's map is not far off of my dyno tune.

Carry on and flame how you wish but myself and others are good with Jeffo's map.

24 pages, over 580 posts and it keeps rolling on...Jeffo would be proud!

hehehehehehe, who needs a reality show?????? As always.... Nice touch Dogo!!!

Yeah I was looking at the pgs and replies and thinking of emailing him a link to this but I know he still would not say anything but he might get a laff out of it.

but he might get a laff out of it.

Or another 50 bucks, this kind of free advertising you can't buy, as long as they are talking about you, You are someone,,,, all Good 4 Jeffo.

24 pages, over 580 posts and it keeps rolling on...Jeffo would be proud!

Amazing. Ok, how much for the new 2012 map ?

Amazing. Ok, how much for the new 2012 map ?

don't forget to change the front sprocket to get the full effect of the jeffo map ..

He-he, kinda like them old snake oil guys would load their potions full of cocaine, who cares if it cured ya!

don't forget to change the front sprocket to get the full effect of the jeffo map ..

Couldn't you get the same effect and save $50 by just changin the front sprocket?

What I'm getting out of it is ,,,,, were all bored. Bike is going to be six years old in 2012. Right now Jeffo is all we got. He should buy us a beer ,,, with all Your Money lol. Sorry slipped out lol

The 3-stooges.

C'Mon Hub, you gota be a stooge. How about a dildo slap for old jeffo,,, or did you also pay your fifty. Tell uncle Rick,,,,Mom's the word lol